1.4 Petrol Timing Belt Change

[Marcianyn]

Hi all,

I am planning to change my timing belt this weekend. Just need to get the parts and maybe some extra tools (hopefully won't).

I found the timing kit and water pump on ECP, so will order those either today or tomorrow, just not too sure on which exact coolant it will need.
Also, for the locking of the cam and crank, I read/saw that a long enough bolt will do for the cam locking. If I lock the cam and mark the crank with a paint marker, will they always be in sync if I were to rotate the crank by accident and move it back to the mark?

And finally, with the 4 manual rotations on the new belt, is that 4 rotations of the crank? Or the whole belt? Might sound like a silly question but really want to nail this on the first try and not have to get new stuff halfway through the process like on my last 3 jobs .

Any advice will be greatly appreciated.

[Arfur Dent]

Hi

For the coolant, check here

Lock the crank and the cam

Yes, use a bolt or drill bit is good because they come in sets of varying sizes.

Rotation of 4 is to settle the belt and set the tensioner. So do this after fitting the belt. Best to follow the instructions that come in the kit.

Replace all the pulleys and the water pump

[Marcianyn]

Got the belt and new water pump fitted.

one issue i now have is that the system is not taking in the same amount of coolant that came out.. (only took 4 liters when 7 came out)
I used the header extension bottle (milk bottle), but it stopped burping after a while and noticed that it started to leak a bit so stopped with that.

Are there any bleed valves on the 1.4 petrol engine and if so, are they easily accessible?

Thanks in advance

[Ozvtr]

Yes there are two bleed points.

One on the firewall where the two heater hoses go into the fire wall. The top one has a cap that you remove to bleed.

The other is on the thermostat housing. If you take the air cleaner housing off and look at the bracket that supports the cleaner you will see a hole in it and what looks like a cheese head screw. Turn this screw out a few turns until coolant begins to dribbles from the thread.

It’s nearly impossible to get all the air out without wasting a massive amount of coolant out the bleed points. You can catch the coolant over flow from the heater line bleed but the over flow from the thermostat just runs all over the place. Try and get as much air out of the system as you can tolerate (you can only mix up and waist so much coolant, you'll see what I mean, the bubbles just don't stop LOL).
You will find the level in the expansion tank will go down over the next few trips you make, as the air is expelled and coolant in the expansion tank replaces the air. Just keep topping the expansion tank up until you stop “loosing” coolant.

[Marcianyn]

It’s nearly impossible to get all the air out without wasting a massive amount of coolant out the bleed points. You can catch the coolant over flow from the heater line bleed but the over flow from the thermostat just runs all over the place. Try and get as much air out of the system as you can tolerate (you can only mix up and waist so much coolant, you'll see what I mean, the bubbles just don't stop LOL).
You will find the level in the expansion tank will go down over the next few trips you make, as the air is expelled and coolant in the expansion tank replaces the air. Just keep topping the expansion tank up until you stop “loosing” coolant.

Silly question:
As you said the level will go down over the next few trips, I assume you will have closed the bleeders before driving right?

[routemaster1]

It’s nearly impossible to get all the air out without wasting a massive amount of coolant out the bleed points. You can catch the coolant over flow from the heater line bleed but the over flow from the thermostat just runs all over the place. Try and get as much air out of the system as you can tolerate (you can only mix up and waist so much coolant, you'll see what I mean, the bubbles just don't stop LOL).
You will find the level in the expansion tank will go down over the next few trips you make, as the air is expelled and coolant in the expansion tank replaces the air. Just keep topping the expansion tank up until you stop “loosing” coolant.

Silly question:
As you said the level will go down over the next few trips, I assume you will have closed the bleeders before driving right?

Yes, close the bleeds. The air will make its way round to the expansion tank. Top up with coolant and repeat until the level doesn't drop. Just watch the temperature gauge, if you have one.

[Marcianyn]

Thanks for the help so far guys. Really appreciate it. Will try the bleeding when I get back home and then update later on how it went. If all goes well that will be a nice £250 saved on the job.

[Ozvtr]

Silly question:
As you said the level will go down over the next few trips, I assume you will have closed the bleeders before driving right?

Sorry, didn't make myself clear. I guess it sounded like the air would be expelled from the purge points as you drove along.

When you are purging the system, the bubbles just don't seem to stop, so bleed off as much as you can tolerate and then seal the bleed points. Remember, you can only make up a finite amount of coolant, it cost money and the waste is not friendly to the environment. Allowing it to just dribble out endlessly is not good but leaving big pockets of air in the system can cause air-locks and potential failure of the cooling system to...well...cool, so what do you do?

As Routemaster1 said the unexpelled bubbles trapped in the system will make their way around to the expansion tank causing the level to go down. If you have done a good job the total you need to top up will be less than a few hundred millilitres.

As a public service announcement (LOL) to anyone else watching this post NEVER, NEVER use tap water to top up or mix with fluids for your car (battery, radiator, even wind screen washer)!!! Tap water contains calcium and other elements that will build up or cause corrosion. Use demineralized water from the supermarket, not from an auto store...they charge too much.
If your car is stored where the ambient temperature gets below 4 degrees Celsius you need to use a coolant (anti freeze) mixture for the cooling system of your engine . If it doesn't, YOU DON'T HAVE TO USE A COOLANT MIXTURE! I'm not going to go into the "which coolant is which" debacle right now.
I'm NOT saying don't use coolant but I am saying if nothing else, use demineralised water in place of tap water.

[Marcianyn]

So I have done the bleeding for a little bit (didn't want to have the engine idling on the drive for too long).
Saw a good amount of bubbles come out with the fluid.

Have done a few drives now with the heating on full blast as well, the fluid has gone down a bit.

Now I am thinking to repeat it once more to be save, but rather than just trying to catch the coolant as it falls down the engine bay, I was thinking to route it using some clear tubing. The only issue is I don't know what diameter will fit snugly over the valve. Any ideas?

Thanks

[Ozvtr]

Have done a few drives now with the heating on full blast as well, the fluid has gone down a bit.

FYI, coolant runs through the heater matrix all the time, there is no valve to shut off the coolant. So cooking yourself for the cause is pointless LOL. Also if you are using a header tank to fill the system you don't need to run the engine while you are purging the system but if you don't have the proper tank to do the job it's more trouble than it's worth. You have to find a way to remove the extra coolant from the header tank and top of the expansion tank (down to the "max" mark) before you take the header off the expansion tank.

Don't have any idea what diameter the bleeder is, just measure it. However the vinyl tube only comes in certain sizes and it might not fit. You still have to deal with the bleed point on the thermostat housing, I cant see any neat way of doing that.

I wouldn't dump the whole system, just go through the bleeding process to check for air if you are that concerned but I wouldn't be. Unfortunately if there is any damage already done to the cylinder head (leading to a blown head gasket) from previous maintenance or lack there of, doing extra work is just a waist of time. If there is no damage to the head, then you have done your bit to at least keep the status quo.
When you took the old water pump out, how did it and the inner part of the housing look? Rusty or white crusty build ups or clean? That should tell you how well maintained it has been. Also are there rusty "tide marks" in the expansion tank? That will also tell you how well (or not) its been maintained.
I hope you didn't use premixed coolant? Always mix your own using the coolant manufacturers ratios to demineralized water. Premixed is a rip-off. Have a look at how much additive is in it. Typically it's about 95% water, that's expensive water! Even if the premix ratio is right, 50 to 66% is water, do the maths, it's still expensive water!