MAF

Questions specifically about a Diesel powered C3 (usually engine or fuel related problems)
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My Name: richardrpf

Member
Posts: 3
Joined: Thu Oct 29, 2015 6:42 pm
Model: C3 2002-2005, Original shape model
Year: 2004 (54)
Engine Size: 1.4 (16v)
Fuel Type: Diesel
Mileage: 102000
Trim Level: VTR+
Gearbox: Manual 5 speed
DPF: No
LHD or RHD: RHD (UK)

Post

Hi
Does anyone know of a viable alternative to the, now unobtainable, 1920LC MAF unit as it seems that when the air temperature sensor fails, the air flow sensor has already failed, the car will stop working and aftermarket units do not have a piece of software necessary to function correctly.
Thanks in advance
Richard
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My Name: C3CAR

Guru
Posts: 2658
Joined: Wed May 04, 2011 10:01 am
Model: C3 2002-2005, Original shape model
Year: 2002 (02)
Engine Size: 1.4 (16v)
Fuel Type: Diesel
Mileage: 140000
Trim Level: Exclusive
Gearbox: Manual 5 speed
DPF: No
LHD or RHD: RHD (UK)
Engine name: DV4 16-valve diesel (90 PS)
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richardrpf wrote:Hi
Does anyone know of a viable alternative to the, now unobtainable, 1920LC MAF unit as it seems that when the air temperature sensor fails, the air flow sensor has already failed, the car will stop working and aftermarket units do not have a piece of software necessary to function correctly.
Thanks in advance
Richard
Hi Richard, there are options listed to replace the 1920LC MAF on a 16v 1.4 C3.

For example, this is a fully compatible OE unit from euro car parts for your C3 1.4 HDi 16v 2004 MAF


If you suspect the MAF is giving trouble, just disconnect it and the car will run on default settings which is good enough to drive around as a temporary measure and not like a 'limp home mode'.

If disconnecting the MAF makes no difference to the drive, you have a fault elsewhere.
My Name: richardrpf

Member
Posts: 3
Joined: Thu Oct 29, 2015 6:42 pm
Model: C3 2002-2005, Original shape model
Year: 2004 (54)
Engine Size: 1.4 (16v)
Fuel Type: Diesel
Mileage: 102000
Trim Level: VTR+
Gearbox: Manual 5 speed
DPF: No
LHD or RHD: RHD (UK)

Post

C3CAR wrote:
richardrpf wrote:Hi
Does anyone know of a viable alternative to the, now unobtainable, 1920LC MAF unit as it seems that when the air temperature sensor fails, the air flow sensor has already failed, the car will stop working and aftermarket units do not have a piece of software necessary to function correctly.
Thanks in advance
Richard
Hi Richard, there are options listed to replace the 1920LC MAF on a 16v 1.4 C3.

For example, this is a fully compatible OE unit from euro car parts for your C3 1.4 HDi 16v 2004 MAF


If you suspect the MAF is giving trouble, just disconnect it and the car will run on default settings which is good enough to drive around as a temporary measure and not like a 'limp home mode'.

If disconnecting the MAF makes no difference to the drive, you have a fault elsewhere.
Hi again
I've tried the europarts option and another "compatible" unit but the fault cannot be cleared with them. I have had all of the wiring checked, no fault found, and a MAF specific test which showed no air flow being measured.spoke to main dealer who agreed that aftermarket parts are not compatible and to Citroen UK who could only suggest scrap yards as the only option
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My Name: C3CAR

Guru
Posts: 2658
Joined: Wed May 04, 2011 10:01 am
Model: C3 2002-2005, Original shape model
Year: 2002 (02)
Engine Size: 1.4 (16v)
Fuel Type: Diesel
Mileage: 140000
Trim Level: Exclusive
Gearbox: Manual 5 speed
DPF: No
LHD or RHD: RHD (UK)
Engine name: DV4 16-valve diesel (90 PS)
Has thanked: 175 times
Been thanked: 93 times

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richardrpf wrote:Hi again
I've tried the europarts option and another "compatible" unit but the fault cannot be cleared with them.
Which fault code do you have?

and is there any drivability or performance issues with the car?
richardrpf wrote:and a MAF specific test which showed no air flow being measured.
Do you know what that test was conducted with?

I have results of a MAF test on lexia diagnostic tool Its a euro car parts compatible one for a 16v HDi 2002 C3, shows a P0102, yet reads airflow and temperature OK, drives well, but even better with the EGR disconnected ;) .
P0102 MAF Flowmeter signal short circuit to earth or open circuit.
P0102 MAF Flowmeter signal short circuit to earth or open circuit.
Which is incorrect because there is a measured airflow showing in the live data as captured and shown below:
Measured airflow live data graph on a ECP aftermarket MAF for a 16v diesel C3 2002
Measured airflow live data graph on a ECP aftermarket MAF for a 16v diesel C3 2002

This is my proof that at least one aftermarket MAF reads both airflow and temperature for the Delphi ECU found in the 16v versions of the early C3 Diesels.


If you don't get similar MAF readings then you probably don't have an actual fault with the MAF and considering the wiring has been tested? you may have an ECU fault?
My Name: OakRune

Member
Posts: 2
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2016 4:39 pm
Model: C3 2002-2005, Original shape model
Year: 2003 (03)
Engine Size: 1.4 (16v)
Fuel Type: Diesel
Mileage: 60000
Trim Level: Exclusive
Gearbox: Manual 5 speed
DPF: No
LHD or RHD: RHD (UK)

Post

Hi,

I've got similar issues with a MAF replacement for a 1.4hdi 2003. Had my Pierburg one tested, airflow fault code - readings collapse as soon as the revs go up. Garage found it couldn't get an OEM replacement so tried an after-market part (made by some company like santata, zentata, or something??).

Immediately put up fault code on air temp which I believe was P0102 causing engine management light. Sent it back, received another, supposedly from a different manufacturer and boxed differently but turned out to be made by the same manufacturer, again same response. My faulty MAF doesn't cause engine light and only shows fault on air flow voltage (and data to back that up), no other code according to my garage.

One replacement came from local parts dealer, the other from Europarts. So, is there a sound replacement for the Pierburg? Does anyone know who manufactures the one listed on the Europarts site?

Many thanks.
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My Name: Arfur Dent

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Posts: 3410
Joined: Sat Jul 23, 2011 3:47 pm
Model: C3 2002-2005, Original shape model
Year: 2002 (52)
Engine Size: 1.4 (16v)
Fuel Type: Diesel
Mileage: 100000
Trim Level: Exclusive
Gearbox: Manual 5 speed
DPF: No
LHD or RHD: RHD (UK)
Engine name: DV4 16-valve diesel (90 PS)
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OakRune wrote:Hi,

I've got similar issues with a MAF replacement for a 1.4hdi 2003. Had my Pierburg one tested, airflow fault code - readings collapse as soon as the revs go up. Garage found it couldn't get an OEM replacement so tried an after-market part (made by some company like santata, zentata, or something??).

Immediately put up fault code on air temp which I believe was P0102 causing engine management light. Sent it back, received another, supposedly from a different manufacturer and boxed differently but turned out to be made by the same manufacturer, again same response. My faulty MAF doesn't cause engine light and only shows fault on air flow voltage (and data to back that up), no other code according to my garage.

One replacement came from local parts dealer, the other from Europarts. So, is there a sound replacement for the Pierburg? Does anyone know who manufactures the one listed on the Europarts site?

Many thanks.
With all these 'faulty' MAFs, are you sure there is not a problem elsewhere on the car? Its unusual to find so many parts that are faulty. There is a post describing ECU wiring problems by User1234 here which may help. Also getting the correct fault codes will help you track down which wiring may be at fault.
You can add an avatar to your account - Avatar or change your vehicle details - Car Bio or even add a signature to your posts - Signature. But this is not all you can do in the User Control Panel :)
My Name: OakRune

Member
Posts: 2
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2016 4:39 pm
Model: C3 2002-2005, Original shape model
Year: 2003 (03)
Engine Size: 1.4 (16v)
Fuel Type: Diesel
Mileage: 60000
Trim Level: Exclusive
Gearbox: Manual 5 speed
DPF: No
LHD or RHD: RHD (UK)

Post

Hi,

Thanks for the reply. No, it's not a fault in lots of parts, it's a fault in a Sensata MAF that, while advertised as a replacement, doesn't seem to work. My faulty Pierburg actually provides normal data until about 1300 revs when the air-flow data goes to zero; whereas the after-market Sensata replacement gives no data and a permanent fault code of P0102 which suggests that the part isn't right (despite two companies sending it as a direct replacement).

So, the question I suppose I wanted to pose is, what is being used by other people with my year model? The Delphi looks the best but at £170 is also the most expensive.

I've managed to track down a new original Pierburg part and I'm hoping I can order it without issues - if I can't get my hands on it I'll either try a second hand Pierburg to make sure everything IS indeed OK then shell out for a Delphi or alternative if someone can suggest one (when it fails).

(To add to the confusion, it seems that an update happened in December 2003 where mine was registered in April 2003 - perhaps there is a difference in parts though both are listed as compatible with a 2003 model).
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My Name: C3CAR

Guru
Posts: 2658
Joined: Wed May 04, 2011 10:01 am
Model: C3 2002-2005, Original shape model
Year: 2002 (02)
Engine Size: 1.4 (16v)
Fuel Type: Diesel
Mileage: 140000
Trim Level: Exclusive
Gearbox: Manual 5 speed
DPF: No
LHD or RHD: RHD (UK)
Engine name: DV4 16-valve diesel (90 PS)
Has thanked: 175 times
Been thanked: 93 times

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OakRune wrote:So, the question I suppose I wanted to pose is, what is being used by other people with my year model?
I have a replacement from Euro Car Parts for my 16v 1.4 HDI its part number is 434540130 on their website (click this).

It works better than the one that didn't work at all for driving, it still shows a P0102 in lexia but the flow data looks ok. I have improved any loss of performance (there may have been some) from the previous one by fitting an EGR Blanking plate from ebay (click here).


I can't be sure of the name of the manufacturer, but the is a sticker on it that says "total quality since 1945". I was expecting a Meat and Doria unit, its not a Pierburg, and if I can remember the make, I will update the topic.
C3 MAF total quality since 1945
C3 MAF total quality since 1945



UPDATE on Monday 9th September 2019.
MAF failed and caused a lack of bottom end power. Disconnecting the MAF cleared the driveability problems mostly in that bottom end power was mostly restored and it became drivable around town again while a replacement is sourced.

The original question was 'which MAF works on the C3 1.4HDi' and after removing it for replacement, it became obvious that the part is a Sensata 7.28342.04

Citroen C3 MAF
Citroen C3 MAF
This one lasted a good couple of years and the replacement for it was another sensata unit from good old ebay, new, but unboxed for a paultry £20 :o
This is yet to be fully tested and I will give a long term (hopefully :lol: ) report on its performance.
My Name: Huxley309

Experienced Member
Posts: 44
Joined: Sun Feb 23, 2014 5:09 am
Model: C3 2002-2005, Original shape model
Year: 2003 (03)
Engine Size: 1.4 (16v)
Fuel Type: Diesel
Mileage: 67000
Trim Level: Exclusive
Gearbox: Manual 5 speed
DPF: No

Post

Any updates?
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My Name: C3CAR

Guru
Posts: 2658
Joined: Wed May 04, 2011 10:01 am
Model: C3 2002-2005, Original shape model
Year: 2002 (02)
Engine Size: 1.4 (16v)
Fuel Type: Diesel
Mileage: 140000
Trim Level: Exclusive
Gearbox: Manual 5 speed
DPF: No
LHD or RHD: RHD (UK)
Engine name: DV4 16-valve diesel (90 PS)
Has thanked: 175 times
Been thanked: 93 times

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Huxley309 wrote: Sun Mar 20, 2016 9:02 amAny updates?
I still have P0102, no MIL. No loss of power or any drivability issues with the aftermarket MAF from ECP.

It is a 434540130 on their website. 'OEM Quality MAF'.

It gets a clean with this stuff at each oil and filer service.



If you want to test if the MAF is causing you driving problems, just disconnect it and see if the driving improves. With improved driving and the MAF disconnected, you have a fault caused by the MAF and changing it will cure the problem.

If disconnecting the MAF makes things worse, then you don't have a MAF problem.
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