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 Post subject: 1.4 16v hdi delphi injector help.
 Post Posted: Sat Sep 07, 2013 4:20 pm 
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Joined: Fri Aug 02, 2013 1:15 am
Posts: 9
About my C3

Model: C3 2002-2005, Original shape model
Year: 2004 (04)
Engine Size: 1.4 (16v)
Fuel Type: Diesel
Mileage: 200000
Trim Level: Exclusive
Gearbox: Manual 5 speed
DPF: No


hello i have a 2004 rpo:10054.
i bought this as a non runner thinking it would be a easy fix and not knowing how much the injectors cost how wrong was i.
anyway after buying and connecting it to the lexia3 it has come up with 22 fault codes at the moment i am interested in resolving the injector problem. the lexia 3 is telling me there is a open circuit on all 4 injectors. i have tested the wiring from the ecu plug to the injectors it all seems fine and when tested with a voltmeter i am getting 1.9v on the 1st two injectors starting from the gearbox end and is intermittent. i have also tested the injectors and short circuit i have striped 1 of the injectors but cannot see any obvious problems. . there are a few things i need help knowing and any help would be much appreciated.
1, what voltage should a be getting to the injectors.
2, should the injectors be testing a short if not what should it be testing.

i have also added the images from the lexia.

many thanks.

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File comment: Lexia Screen Capture
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File comment: Lexia Screen Capture
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lexia-screen4.jpg [ 436.48 KiB | Viewed 2103 times ]




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 Post subject: 1.4 16v hdi delphi injector help. continues below this advertising post.
Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 6:33 am 
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 Post subject: Re: 1.4 16v hdi delphi injector help.
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 08, 2013 1:31 pm 
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Group: Guru
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Joined: Wed May 04, 2011 10:01 am
Posts: 1621
About my C3

Model: C3 2002-2005, Original shape model
Year: 2002 (02)
Engine Size: 1.4 (16v)
Fuel Type: Diesel
Mileage: 80000
Trim Level: Exclusive
Gearbox: Manual 5 speed
DPF: No
Welcome to the forum imdady, that's quite a list of errors you have, no wonder its a non-runner.


Quote:
at the moment i am interested in resolving the injector problem

My questions is 'why?'

All those errors look like they are engine ECU generated, so just chipping away at each one won't do you much good. I would look at the bigger picture and investigate why the car reports all those ECU errors.

Something like the wiring plug to the ECU or the ECU itself (damaged by jump-starting).


Quote:
1, what voltage should a be getting to the injectors.

Its a very short pulse, so you will need a scope to capture a signal train. According to delphi, the injectors are 12v.

BUT, a warning from Citroen (for delphi/bosch and siemens injectors)
Quote:
WARNING
given the presence of high voltages at the terminals of the ECU and diesel injectors, voltages
should always be measured with the recommended equipment
WARNING
do not supply a diesel injector with 12 volts(diesel injector will be damaged)


Attachment:
File comment: injector operating signal C3 16v delphi
Injector_operating_signal.jpg
Injector_operating_signal.jpg [ 19.99 KiB | Viewed 2103 times ]

No timebase available, so not so much use, but it's just to show a typical delphi injector signal



Quote:
2, should the injectors be testing a short if not what should it be testing.

The injectors don't test anything. The ECU can measure the current flow to the injector and report if its open circuit or short circuit, but with all those ecu faults, who would believe that all those parts are faulty.

These may be useful, they show the wiring to the engine ECU. It would be worth looking for a common plug (common to all the ECU faults)

Attachment:
File comment: 16v HDi C3 Wiring (IC60)
ic60-wiring.png
ic60-wiring.png [ 127.21 KiB | Viewed 2103 times ]


Attachment:
File comment: IC60 and other engine ECU to sensor connections
IC60_connection_Citroen_C3_wiring-engine.jpg
IC60_connection_Citroen_C3_wiring-engine.jpg [ 131.63 KiB | Viewed 2103 times ]



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 Post subject: Re: 1.4 16v hdi delphi injector help.
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 08, 2013 10:11 pm 
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Group: Contributor
Contributor

Joined: Fri Aug 02, 2013 1:15 am
Posts: 9
About my C3

Model: C3 2002-2005, Original shape model
Year: 2004 (04)
Engine Size: 1.4 (16v)
Fuel Type: Diesel
Mileage: 200000
Trim Level: Exclusive
Gearbox: Manual 5 speed
DPF: No
Hi and many thanks C3CAR for reply and advice.
I forgot to mention that a managed to get the engine running by spraying some wd40 into the turdbo to get it started and then had it running on propane/butane gas made my forget about all the other faults.
also a read that it could be caused by bad earthing so cleaned various earth points obviously with no joy.
now looking back and the ecu faults and knowing that the continuity of the wiring loom between the ecu and injector is ok this makes me think that the ecu is blown. also testing the injector and getting a short circuit reading i'm not sure whether it's blown too.
i have added photos of the striped injector. i also have a video of the engine running on gas but not sure how to upload the this site yet.

Attachment:
File comment: suspect faulty injector part
IMG_20130908_223910.jpg
IMG_20130908_223910.jpg [ 1.88 MiB | Viewed 2096 times ]


Attachment:
File comment: Striped injector
IMG_20130908_223752.jpg
IMG_20130908_223752.jpg [ 1.83 MiB | Viewed 2096 times ]


anymore help much appreciated.

many thanks
imdady.



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 Post subject: Re: 1.4 16v hdi delphi injector help.
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 08, 2013 10:51 pm 
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Group: Guru
Guru
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Joined: Wed May 04, 2011 10:01 am
Posts: 1621
About my C3

Model: C3 2002-2005, Original shape model
Year: 2002 (02)
Engine Size: 1.4 (16v)
Fuel Type: Diesel
Mileage: 80000
Trim Level: Exclusive
Gearbox: Manual 5 speed
DPF: No
Thanks for the pictures of the injector. That is the first one I have seen in bits, the super fine tolerances and difficulty in finding parts has always put me off opening up the delphi ones :(

There is a who can let you know if the injector is OK.


Testing HDi injectors with the Hartridge CRi-PC test bench



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 Post subject: Re: 1.4 16v hdi delphi injector help.
 Post Posted: Mon Sep 09, 2013 8:48 am 
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Group: Guru
Guru

Joined: Sat Jul 23, 2011 3:47 pm
Posts: 1821
About my C3

Model: C3 2002-2005, Original shape model
Year: 2002 (52)
Engine Size: 1.4 (16v)
Fuel Type: Diesel
Mileage: 100000
Trim Level: Exclusive
Gearbox: Manual 5 speed
DPF: No
Trouble with the engine ecu is that its coded to the bsi, you can't start the car without a matching bsi and ecu code. You can get your engine ECU tested; contact BBA-Reman via their ebay store who provide a testing and repair service. The advantage of a repair (other than the warranty) is that you keep the original coding in the ECU which keep the immobiliser codes synchronised with the BSI.


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 Post subject: Re: 1.4 16v hdi delphi injector help.
 Post Posted: Mon Sep 09, 2013 5:47 pm 
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Group: Contributor
Contributor

Joined: Fri Aug 02, 2013 1:15 am
Posts: 9
About my C3

Model: C3 2002-2005, Original shape model
Year: 2004 (04)
Engine Size: 1.4 (16v)
Fuel Type: Diesel
Mileage: 200000
Trim Level: Exclusive
Gearbox: Manual 5 speed
DPF: No
my c3 running on gas




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 Post subject: Re: 1.4 16v hdi delphi injector help.
 Post Posted: Mon Sep 09, 2013 8:14 pm 
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Group: Contributor
Contributor

Joined: Fri Aug 02, 2013 1:15 am
Posts: 9
About my C3

Model: C3 2002-2005, Original shape model
Year: 2004 (04)
Engine Size: 1.4 (16v)
Fuel Type: Diesel
Mileage: 200000
Trim Level: Exclusive
Gearbox: Manual 5 speed
DPF: No
hi i don't know if i've jumped the gun but i've bought a ecu with the keys as i last minute impulse buy from ebay for £50 as it seemed like a bargain. i don't know what i'm going to do about the injectors yet as the one on the cam side seems jammed for now i've left it soaked in wd40. does any know if i can buy the internal components especially the part i suspect if faulty.

any help?

thanks.

p.s ebay item number : 251333603013



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 Post subject: Re: 1.4 16v hdi delphi injector help.
 Post Posted: Mon Sep 09, 2013 8:54 pm 
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Group: Guru
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Joined: Sat Apr 30, 2011 7:40 pm
Posts: 1162
About my C3

Arfur Dent wrote:
Trouble with the engine ecu is that its coded to the bsi, you can't start the car without a matching bsi and ecu code.


imdady wrote:
i've an bought a ecu with the keys



If you don't have the BSI that matches the ECU, it won't pass the immobiliser test :(


imdady wrote:
i don't know if i've jumped the gun

You have :o


The solution is to either try to 'immo off' the ECU - needs someone who knows what they are doing with flashing chips or put it down to experience and get the full package (ECU,BSI,Transponder,Keys) like: , its not the right one for your car, but you can see they are sold as a 'kit' to enable the car to start.



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 Post subject: Re: 1.4 16v hdi delphi injector help.
 Post Posted: Wed Oct 30, 2013 8:48 pm 
Offline
Group: Contributor
Contributor

Joined: Fri Aug 02, 2013 1:15 am
Posts: 9
About my C3

Model: C3 2002-2005, Original shape model
Year: 2004 (04)
Engine Size: 1.4 (16v)
Fuel Type: Diesel
Mileage: 200000
Trim Level: Exclusive
Gearbox: Manual 5 speed
DPF: No
Hello chaps long time no speak.
Right this is where i am at the mo i've changed the ecu set,cleared all the fault history from the ecu but still not starting.
i have re-read the ecu and now getting the following messages which seem to reappear.



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 Post subject: Re: 1.4 16v hdi delphi injector help.
 Post Posted: Thu Oct 31, 2013 2:13 pm 
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Group: Guru
Guru

Joined: Sat Jul 23, 2011 3:47 pm
Posts: 1821
About my C3

Model: C3 2002-2005, Original shape model
Year: 2002 (52)
Engine Size: 1.4 (16v)
Fuel Type: Diesel
Mileage: 100000
Trim Level: Exclusive
Gearbox: Manual 5 speed
DPF: No
For your P0125

Quote:
http://citroenc3owners.com/resources/image/thumb/864



Have a look at my reply to fred39 who has the same fault code.
http://citroenc3owners.com/diesel-citroen-c3/c3-diesel-non-runner-t757.html


for the pre-heat relays, not urgent, but if you want to fix it,
Quote:
http://citroenc3owners.com/resources/image/thumb/866

I suggest you change both the relay and the pre heaters at the same time. Faulty glow plugs damage the relay and a faulty relay will damage the plugs. Change both at the same time.

, and euro car parts have the glow plugs.


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To add or edit your vehicle information on the system which appears with every post (see the example on the left).
While logged in, visit https://citroenc3owners.com/ucp.php?i=profile&mode=profile_info to update your cars profile at the bottom.


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 Post subject: Re: 1.4 16v hdi delphi injector help.
Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 6:33 am 
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